Fun with Real Estate Taxes, Laws and Mark J. Kohler | EREI 22

Fun with Real Estate Taxes, Laws and Mark J. Kohler | EREI 22

Mark J. Kohler (, one of the nation’s most distinguished experts in real estate tax law, is Matt’s special guest on the show today. Now’s the time to get answers to all your tax and legal questions.

Download Matt’s free real estate investing course now at


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Podcast Transcript:
(Voice Over): You’re about to meet a man that can show you how he took control of his life and financial future and how you can do the same. He’s never been on TV. He’s not a millionaire and he does not know Donald Trump. He is a fulltime real estate investor, newly discovered author and family man. He does not report to a boss, he creates his own schedule and takes his family on a few vacations every year.

He got started investing in real estate with almost no money and a really crummy credit score and he’s going to show you exactly how he did it and how he continues to do it. You will have to work. You will have to be responsible. However, laying by the beach sipping fruity drinks is a reasonable goal. Without further delay, your guru, sorry, your guide to a better life through real estate investing, Matt Theriault.

Matt Theriault: Hello and greetings from the Epic Real Estate Investing Podcast. The podcast that will show you how to build wealth through creative real estate investing so you’ll have the option to realistically retire in the next 10 years or less and enjoy the good life while you’re still young enough to do so.

That’s what it’s all about. You got to retire. You got to enjoy the retirement or you have to have to the option to retire while you’re still young enough to enjoy it. My name is Matt Theriult, author, full time real estate investor and family man. If this is your first time listening to this show, you’re going to want to do two things.

First, go back and listen to episode one for the ground rules of the show. Two, download the Free Real Estate Investing course, “How to do Deals, No Money Required”. You can get that at It’s a step-by-step course of which I unveiled the mystery around doing deals with no money or credit.

That’s yours for free. Now I hope you’ve been enjoying our series of real estate investors, real real estate investors succeeding in today’s market. Based off the flood of comments and emails that I received, it appears to be a big hit and will certainly resume with the series. However today I want to take a little break from that series given the time of year.

No, not the holiday season to what I’m referring is that we’re approaching the end of the year and we’re about to begin tax season. So today, I’ve invited a very special guest, a good friend, the utmost authority that I know on real estate tax law. He’s an attorney, CPA, entrepreneur, best-selling author, national speaker, radio show host and news contributor.

He is known as the nation’s leading voice for entrepreneurs and small business owners, having taught thousands and thousands of people including myself how to take control of their financial future and steer their business to success through his powerful business tax and legal strategies.

He has two books. By the way I highly recommend both of them, “Lawyers Are Liars” and “What Your CPA Isn’t Telling You.” He’s going to talk about those in a little bit. You can find those books on his website of which I’ll give you the address at the end of the show or they can easily be found at, okay?

So without further ado, today I’m joined by Mr. Mark Kohler. Mark, welcome to the Epic Real Estate Investing Podcast.

Mark Kohler: Thank you so much for having me, love to be here.

Matt: Awesome, awesome. I’ve been looking forward to this conversation. Hey Mark, just real quick before we get started, could you just kind of tell us a little bit about your background and what you do and why you do what you do and how great you are?

Mark: Well Matt, thank you so much I could probably talk about that longer than I should. So I’ll hit the highlights because I’m very passionate about what I do but I’m a CPA and an attorney and an entrepreneur, real estate investor and family man, wife and four kids, lives in Southern California and I love to surf. I understand we’re going to be talking about surfing most of this hour.

Matt: Yes, that’s accurate. (laugh)

Mark: Okay, maybe not. Okay, sorry. So anyway, I love taxes. I love entrepreneurship. Isn’t that crazy? Now I don’t like to pay taxes, I just like to plan around them. I was one of those kids that have Lego set or Lincoln Log Set, Rector Set. I love to build structures and ethical and honest structures to help my clients save money and build wealth.

I’ve written two best-selling books. “What Your CPA Isn’t Telling You” is my newest book out. It’s a fictional story of a family that discovers tax strategies that changes their life. It’s awesome, based after the Modern Family, Phil Dunphy, my hero.

Then also, my book before that, titled, “Lawyers are Liars: The Truth About Protecting Our Assets,” another incredible book on helping people avoid the scams when they go set up their structures and entities to protect their assets and build wealth.

I have a weekly radio show nationwide, weekly newsletter, and I have a full service accounting firm and law firm where we help clients all around the country. So I guess we’re going to be talking about taxes and legal and not surfing.

Matt: Right, no, no surfing today. Maybe another show, absolutely. Hey you know, I’d actually most of this conversation is going to be on legal and tax strategies and tax issues. But you’ve mentioned just one you introduced yourself that you are a real estate investor. how did you get started in real estate investing and what was your initial attraction, I guess.

Mark: Well there’s probably two answers to that. The first one is I’m so grateful to my dad. He was a wonderful mentor and an example to me. As soon as I was running off to college and getting married, he bought me a duplex. He helped me with the down payment and I got my loan. I had a duplex for five years as I went to undergrad. I learned how to be a property manager the hard way so I just do it.

Then he taught me that he always thought of real estate, he was a doctor. He was actually a microbiologist. He wasn’t a physician but a microbiologist. He knew that was wealth was in real estate and that’s what he taught me.

Then the second time in my life where I realized it was important is when I started to become a tax lawyer and understanding all the tax benefits and wealth building aspect to round off real estate.

So now in my new book and when I teach clients, I recommend that every one of my clients buy one rental property a year and no matter what industry they’re in, find one rental property a year is an incredible way to save taxes and wealth.

Matt: I’ve heard that. I heard you make the same recommendation to your employees as well. Is that true?

Mark: Yeah, I tell the employees that. I don’t think they’d listen to me as much as my clients.

Matt: Right, well good. I initially, I was inspired to call you up because you’re probably the best that I know at what I wanted to discuss with you today. I sent out a survey to the listeners and asked them their most burning questions about real estate investing and I’ve got bombarded with a bunch and bunch of questions.

I’ve been spending the last couple of weeks answering those and bringing on other people and help me answer some of those questions. Some of them were out of my expertise but I was really surprised and shocked on how many questions I got that are in the legal realm and the tax realm.

So I just, you know, I couldn’t think of any person better to invite on the show to help me answer this so I’m just going to go through these questions with you.  There are in no particular order. This is just kind of how they came through and we’ll take a stab at her.

Mark: Well, awesome. I love it, this is easy for me. So I know that sound, I don’t mean to sound prima donna or cocky about it but that’s the easy way to go at it for me too. So go head and shoot.

Matt: Perfect, okay. So question number one, what entity should I choose, when and why? It’s a broad, broad question. I know.

Mark: Well let’s tackle world peace. That’s a little easier. Okay, all right, well, let me say. This is something I talked about in my new book extensively and in my online videos and I talk about this a lot.

This is a big topic.  Let me give you some general rules. The first thing is you have to decide what type of real estate you are doing.

If you are doing short term real estate such as whole sales, fix and flips, rehabs, quick turnaround property that you’re not going to hold more than, you’re going to hold less than 12 months then an S corporation is going to be general best fit.

Now you’re going to have those very, very unique scenarios where a C corporation might work, which I’m not a big fan of as an average investor.

There are situations where you could just do it through a LLC, a single member LLC and tax for a single proprietorship which is going to be very rare as well because it is self-employment tax.

I want to use an S corporation, tell my clients to have short-term real estate deals to avoid self-employment tax. Many of you may not know that if you do fix and flips, you’re going to pay 15% in taxes on the net income even before income taxes, state or central.

It’s a nightmare. The S corporation is the best way to go. I’ve written books about it, I’ll argue with anybody and if anybody tries to sell you a C corporation, freaking get a second opinion. So that’s issue number one.

Matt: Got it.

Mark: If some of you are doing long term holds, rental property, apartment complexes, seller finance notes, things like that that are long term in nature creates interest or rent or capital gain if you hold it more than 12 months, typically the LLC is going to be the best at limited liability company. Now if some state are very expensive and I talk about on my radio show today.

Not every time you should run out and set up an LLC but generally, yes. You should have an LLC in place for your rentals. Now not every rental even a quick five or six rentals in one LLC but you also set them up in a state where you’re doing business and you make sure that the deed is transferred, you used the LLC name. Be careful of limited partnerships, limited partnerships are fantastic for certain types of assets but typically not rental properties.  So watch out for that.

Matt: Got it. There are a lot of people that listen to this show that are just getting started in real estate investing. One of the questions that came out actually pretty frequently was, “Is it necessary to establish your entity before you do that first transaction or can you do it for the fact?”

Mark: Well that can be a loaded question. Typically, let’s do short term versus long term again, which is a scene that I talk about a lot. Just making sure we’re choosing the right entity and short term and long term position. If you’re doing the long term deal, buying the rental property, the last thing I want to do is have you set up an entity before you close.

It doesn’t make sense. Even if they make an offer on the project you don’t even know if it’s going to go through. Buy the property and most lenders are going to require you to close in your own name in anyway. Then you’re going to deed the property over to the LLC after closing. So for example, Matt, happens all the time.

A client calls and goes, “Hey, I’m going buy rentals, set up my LLC.” and I go, “Where are you going to buy your rentals?” “Well, I don’t know. I might buy in Georgia or Oklahoma or Utah or Arizona.” Then I’ll say, “Well, great. As soon as you get that first property, call me and we’ll get it set up the day after you close or during closing. But if you don’t know where you’re going to set up your rental, why set up a LLC in the wrong state?”

So that’s issue number one. If it’s a rental property, it definitely wants to get a LLC but we’ll want to make sure you’re going to have a closing and own the property before we set something up. It can be a waste of money. On short term deals, I think it is important to have an entity before deals. It can be a little scary with the potential loss, doing the rehab.

You know buying a property in your own name and then hiring vendors and contractors. You got kids running around on the property at night and lighting fires and you know, vandalizing and also getting into a law suit with the vendor contractor.

Who knows who? So if you’re going to be doing rehabs and fix and flips, it may be good to get your entity set up right off the bat for asset protection purposes.

The tax benefits will slow thereafter. You may want to do the first deal in your own name and just know that you’ve got some exposure and with the profits from that first deal, get your entity in place. So you’re probably getting an entity as soon as possible in short term deals.

Matt: Got it, got it. Cool. So this next question, actually the next two questions, I want to kind of combine them into one. I’ll do my best and hopefully you can follow along as I do this.

The first question was, “What are the five most valued tax tips for the real estate investor for 2011?” Then the next question is, “What is changing in 2012?”

So I guess we can kind of talk about what’s happening in 2011. We’re here in December. What can someone do in 2011 that they might not able to do in 2012 and kind of play with that, I guess.

Mark:  Well Matt, this is, I know hard for you. I don’t mean to make your podcast left valuable here but the question of “What are the best tax strategies in 2011 for real estate investors?” I mean, I hold seminars on that topic. In “What are the changes for 2012?”, That’s a two-day seminar that I go through every January.

So this is a very, very difficult question. So bless your heart whoever it was that asked it. Let me hit a few highlights. Again, I highly encourage you to check out my online videos at or my book to get some additional help on this. If your CPA doesn’t know this topic backwards and forwards and isn’t holding webinars and online videos and radio shows to help you, then you got the wrong CPA.

You shouldn’t be trusting somebody that’s not life as CPA or an attorney. Please stay away from these “coaches” trying to play lawyers CPA. That’s why Matt I want to applaud you because you said, “Hey, I’m not going to try answer these. I’m going to get an expert to answer them in which I think is the way to go.” Great job, Matt.

So, gosh, tax strategies as a real estate investor. Number one, buy  a rental every year, no brainer. Everybody, I want all my clients buying a rental every year. The reason is for four quadrants, so that I talked about on a regular basis Number one, appreciation, which is the cherry on top if we don’t buy rental for appreciation.

That’s the problem we got into in 2007. Mortgage reduction, the renters pay the mortgage for you. You’re building equity as the renter pays the rent.

Number three of tax benefits, you’re going to get full through losses. It carries forward or immediate deductible against your current income.

Number four is cash flow. Those four benefits; appreciation, mortgage reduction, taxes and cash flow.  That’s why I won’t make clients find a rental every year.

Number two if possible, I want my clients, they ate themselves or their spouse to qualify as a real estate professional. Being a real estate professional allows you to take 100% dollar-for-dollar write ups on your rental properties against your ordinary income.

Again, another huge benefit if you’re going to be in the real estate industry. So you want to be thinking about being a real estate professional. Boy, what else to tell you. There’s cost segregation where you can write off cattle’s faster than 27 and a half years or 39 years of its commercial. You, I just got off a phone call literally right before this podcast, Matt.

I got phone call talking about 1031 exchanges, referring the taxes on one property and rolling it into the next. That’s an important strategy every real estate investor should know. I want to have all my clients put their family on payroll. I want them to be writing off travel, making sure they’re buying rental properties where they travel.

I want you to be self-directing your array and buying rental real estate. Oh my gosh Matt, you’re going to wear wash stock, you know.

Matt: Right, right. It’s a big question.

Mark: Yeah it is.

Matt: It only took up one little line on my piece of paper. I had no idea the answer was going to be so huge.

Mark: Oh my God.

Matt: So what I’m getting here is, let me ask this. Obviously there’s so much to know, so much to learn that the real estate investor themselves just couldn’t possibly keep up with everything that’s why there are CPAs and there are tax attorneys. What can a real estate investor do to confirm that their own CPA, their own tax attorney is up to speed or can they do anything?

Mark: That’s a great question. I thought your question was going to be what type of resources should be returning to and let me answer that into a two-part question. Finding out that you have a right CPA, some of you out there don’t want a CPA.  You think you can do it yourself and I’m talking to you engineers out there.

Yes you’re listening. I know you are because engineers, they want to do it all themselves and they think they can figure it out. Be careful. I don’t ask my engineer why he’s using the certain five or two by fours and bolts in my house.

I just trust him, the highly qualified engineer. But anyway, let me say this. First of all, all of you out there, you should be soaking up tax and legal information wherever possible.

You’re going to start to be able to scent what are scams and promises and too good to be true type strategies. As you soak these information up. Now, I’ll say this. Competitors are lined that have newsletters that are fantastic. I subscribe to my competitor’s newsletters. You should be getting two to three tax newsletters. If you’re not, it’ll be subscribe to mine.

Make sure that you’re getting tax and legal newsletter every week or month. Number two, try to pick up the best tax and legal books that are out there and work your way through it. Some of them are extremely boring. That’s why my angle is a story and I make them both very interesting and fun with a lot of little examples and I even have a chat room OJ Simpson which is a lot of fun.

So I’m going to show, so I try to keep my books lively. But read books that you can. I have a radio show every week, I have a podcast every week. I have online videos that are very fun and informative and affordable, $150.00 for 6-8 hours of video. I’m not trying to be sale-sy here. If you’re not using me, use someone that’s giving you that type of information.

They should be licensed practitioners that are actually going to find your freaking tax return. I’m sick and tired of clients coming here, “Oh, someone told me to do this.” Really? Are they signing your tax returns?  “No, but they got some great tips.” What the heck, if someone sign your tax return, their word is worth nothing.

I carry malpractice insurance and a life insurance. If I sign your tax return and screw up, I’m the one that pays the bill. So get advice from people that are out there. Then I just find the right CPA, take some of these tax tips that I just mentioned today. Walk into your CPA and go, “Hey, where should I buy my rental property?” “Oh well, I don’t even know if you should buy rental property. That doesn’t make sense.”

You just seem to market out there. Hell, it’s a buyer’s market out there. They’re not talking to you and buy real estate. What kinds of CPA are there? Are they helping you write off your kids or family members in your business? Are they writing off your auto and travel and dining and entertainment creatively? Are they bringing ideas to you?

Talk to them about self-directing your IRA or 401k. What did they say? Did they look like deer in headlights? You got the wrong guy, the wrong gal. Ask them about being a real estate professional. Just do this. Walk in and go, “How do I qualify as a real estate professional?” If they say, “Well, let me look it up.” You got the wrong guy, the wrong gal.

These are people that should have, if you’re going to be in real estate, you need a real estate attorney or CPA that’s freaking doing it every day. I’m so sorry. I’m getting into a soapbox here. That’s just huge. Sorry, Matt.

Matt: That’s fine. It’s perfect. That’s why you’re here Mark because this can be a very boring subject and people out there without the passion and I know you have the passion for it. You know, you’re the best that I know.

So that’s why you’re here, so thank you for sharing that. Let’s switch gears a little bit. Next question is, “What are the most important aspects when partnering up with another investor and it shouldn’t be written up and signed by both parties?”

Mark: Well…

Matt: I can hear you laughing about that before I asked.

Mark: Well, it’s a great question. I’m glad we went over this question. This is an excellent question that I can answer with a little more certainty.

Obviously the person that asked the question gave the first point and that is make sure you got it in gosh darn writing. If you’re going to partner with someone, make sure it’s very clear on who does what, what are the expectations. Plan for the worst case scenario, make sure that you’re thinking of the loose ends and if your partner isn’t willing to talk about what happens if they don’t do their job, you’ve got the wrong partner. A partner should be willing to have those hard conversations and you’re going to find it real quick in your gut.

“Ugh, this kind of hit is down. They’re kind of crazy. I mean why aren’t they thinking about this or that and everything is not pie in the sky.” You got a plan for the worst case and so, if you got someone that’s some got aggressive or optimistic, you got to watch out. The other thing that I just would point out is making sure whatever you sign, get it reviewed.

Pay an attorney for half-hour or an hour but the most; it only costs you $200.00 or $300.00. Just say, “Hey, I got under, I got my attorney look at this.” “Oh, you do? Well just trust me. You don’t need a lawyer” That’s when you need to get a lawyer, someone says that. So make sure you get it reviewed for an hour.

I guess another little tip that I would make to is if someone’s trying to partner with you and I love partnering. I’m not saying partnering is bad, just do it right. That’s all. If someone comes up to you and says, “Hey Matt. Move quick. We got to move fast.” That means slow down because as soon as you start moving fast, that’s when mistake happens and people get taken advantage of.

One of the biggest scams out there right now is called Affinity Market Scams where people in your church, in your neighbourhood, your family comes to you and says, “Come on. Do this deal with me” And because they’re friends or family, you don’t go through all the steps. Make me your bad guy. Say, “I promise Mark Kohler, my attorney, that I would not do any deal unless he’d looked at it.

“Oh, okay.” You should getting a weird feeling and follow your gut. I’ll make you a promise right now. There’s going to be another deal next week. I can promise you that. So if someone says, “You got to do move right now. There’ll be no other deal like this.”

Trust me. There’ll be another deal like this. More important factor is, are you ready for the deal and is your ducks in law the line and do you have your right? Are your ducks around the right person?

They are very, very important. So there’s so much to be concerned there and hopefully these tips help.

Matt: No, definitely. Good answer. Next question, I heard that it’s possible to make millions in cash flow and pay zero taxes on it. Sometimes you even get money back from the IRS. How is this done?

Mark: Well, it is possible. I know that sounds crazy, it is. I’ll give you three words. Real estate professional, that’s it. If you’re a real estate professional, my clients that are real estate professionals have tax free cash flow from the rentals and they’re not paying taxes.

Because as  a real estate professional, all the depreciation and mortgage interest is a 100% write off against your other income and cash flow.

It will exceed the cash flow. Now if you’re going to own properties 100%, no money down and own properties outright, you’re probably going to pay some taxes.

Depreciation will not chew up the cash flow. But if you got renters and you got and you leveraged your money and you’re using the bank’s money which I think is very wise.

And is you’re cautious, you’re going to have tons of cash flow and no taxes. It’s very do-able. Talked about that in my book, it’s a chapter in my book.

Matt: When you say real estate professional you don’t mean real estate agent, right?

Mark: No, that’s true. The definition of a real estate professional is a two-part test. One is it’s your primary occupation. That doesn’t mean you have to be a life realtor contractor or mortgage lender. It just means you do real estate, managing rentals, doing rehabs, fix and flips. if you have one rental property and you’re retired, you should say you’re a real estate professional and that’s all you do is manage one little rental.

But the second part of the test is that you spend 13 hours a week, which a total of 750 hours a year, you can do all that time in half a year but the point is you have to show 750 hours of work in real estate throughout the year. Two part test, then if your spouse qualifies, you both qualify which is a fantastic option.

Matt: Right, right. So you want to marry right?

Mark: Yeah, that’s true.

Matt: Oh, my joke fell on deaf ears. Chirp, chirp, chirp.

Mark: No, no. It was good.

Matt: No, so. Oh! You said you have to show the 750 hours of work. How do you show the work?

Mark: Well I do recommend for my clients that are on the bubble that they are keeping, you should keep a calendar. All of you should be keeping an outlet calendar or scheduler and logging your hours, working on your books, working on properties, going to education meetings, sales meeting, meeting with the vendors, clients, contractors, whatever you’re doing that is real estate, keep a record in your outlet calendar.

Matt: Got it, got it. Okay cool. Here’s the next one. Rumour has it that the IRS is looking at small businesses closer and closer. What are some of the bigger things that the IRS looks for when deciding who they’re going to audit?

Mark: Well the IRS is ramping up their audit and happens the last three or four years. The number one thing that they’re looking for in small businesses is a sole proprietor. If you want to reduce your chance within an audit, get into an S corporation or a two member LLC for your business. I can reduce your taxes, your chances of an audit by 1500%.

Matt: Wow.

Mark: That’s 15 times less chance of an audit, huge. What they’re looking for really and there’s not one particular item that the IRS is looking at. They’re looking at items that jump out, items that don’t look normal for the type of business you’re doing. They stand out because you may only have a thousand dollars of income but you wrote off $20,000.00 in real estate education.

Focus isn’t going to fly. You’re going to get an audit. So be careful trying to ride off all of your, I know some of you listening has spent some money on real estate education. I’m not saying you can’t write it off but write it off over time as a start-up cost or amateurize it. Don’t try to write off $20,000.00 in real estate education with only a few thousand dollars of income.

You will be audited. Dining, entertainment, travel, education, all of those are reasonable write offs as they look balanced with your tax return. This is why I’m trying to knock out your own return on turbo tax may not be your best bet.

Getting a CPA that can tell, “Oh, that’s red flag. That’s not red flag.” Because if your CPA screws up your return and recommend something aggressive position and they’re wrong, that CPA should be paying the penalties and interest on it so keep that in mind.

Matt: Got it. What percentage of tax returns is getting audited? Do you have any idea?

Mark: I don’t. There are statistical reports that come out. I report those in my newsletter on a regular basis but I don’t have them handy right now. Good question, sorry.

Matt: Okay, good reason to get the newsletter.

Mark: Yeah.

Matt: What are some common tax/legal mistakes investors make that cost them money?

Mark: Well, a lot of new real estate investors do not maximize their write offs as much as they should. They keep poor records. They don’t do book keeping. They operated as sole proprietor. They take large write offs that stand out. They don’t even know about the real estate professional classification. They’re not writing off their rentals in the right way. These are all different ways to screw up your return.

Sometimes they say, “Well gosh Mark, I got to pay you for an hour once a year to look at my returns.” Yeah, that’s $300. I’m about to save you 20 times that in taxes easily. Seriously, I can save you $3,000 to $6,000 in taxes by just looking at your cash return and making sure it’s done right and is it balanced? What are the things you should be doing?

Whoever is asking these questions, they should be saying, “Oh, I don’t even need to ask Tom. I just need to get my appointment with my awesome, freaking CPA firm and they’ll do a great job.” Is that really? By the way, I got an awesome team. If you find a CPA that has all the time in the world for you, you probably have the wrong CPA because if they’re good, they’re busy.

So I got four CPAs, five CPA partners, a staff of about 15. We assign a personal tax consultant to every one of our clients and where they can get access quickly and affordably. Don’t feel like you have to call and schedule time with me. I’m here, I’m the architect. If you need me once a year to go over everything, that’s cool.

But please work with my team and realize that I’m not trying to be everything for everybody. That’s why I got just great people around me.

Matt: Right, right, awesome. Let’s talk about the titles of your books, the very unique titles. “Lawyers Are Liars”, we’ll start with that one. Obviously there’s a hook there because you’re a lawyer yourself. I don’t think you call yourself a liar so what do you actually mean by lawyers are liars?

Mark: Be that. It’s just a discussion point. I mean that honestly, not an accusation. There’s a lot of people out there that call lawyers liars and they’re really just scam artists trying to get you to avoid lawyers and buy their crap. They didn’t want to spend the time to go to Law School so they’re going to call themselves a coach and just say, “Oh your lawyer’s an idiot. I know better.”

Right there that’s the group that I’m really trying to write my book to protect clients from. So watch out for these online services that are trying to set up your entity for you or give you bulletproof asset protection. It’s a bunch of crap.

So I wrote the first half of the book go through what scams are out there and the second half of the book tells you what really works.  It’s kind of fun.

Matt: Got it, got it. Your next, “What’s Your CPA Isn’t Telling You – Life Changing Tax Strategies.” So what are some of the things that the CPAs aren’t telling them?

Mark: Well, it is the first thing is and I write it as a story which is a lot of fun for a lot of people. So in the story, the biggest thing that this couple in this family realizes is that their CPA was a porch communicator and did not bring them ideas and strategies and they’re far too conservative, opinionated. Which is a lot of CPAs are that way.

They’re stodgy, they’re, you know, there’s a reason why you see those A typical in movies and TV shows as an accountant. They’re generally accurate. So we try to be outside the box. The story in my book goes through the real estate issue, self-directing our IRA, hiring your family members to start a small business and the story of death and triumph and tragedy and someone who loses their healthcare and what are their options.

It’s really cool so that’s the theory of the story. The book sold out the first six months. It’s gone to reprint. This will be the first tax I’m coming up in a month that it’s out and we’re expecting great things.  It got a lot of attraction and so anybody that’s interested, you can go or my website,

Just type in there, “What your CPA Isn’t Telling You” and by the time you type “isn’t”, my book will pop out.

Matt: Awesome. The insta-search now, right?

Mark: Yeah.

Matt: Well congratulations on your success. So the names of the books, “Lawyers Are Liars” and “What Your CPA Isn’t Telling You”. You’ve mentioned you have a radio show. How would someone if they wanted to listen to that, where would they find that?

Mark: Well, again on my website, You can get links to all of my prior shows and the show is repute at 11 AM, Pacific. If you want to go to the portal, it’s an Internet radio show where you can listen live or afterwards on the Internet. It’s Blog, B-L-O-G, Just type in Mark J Kohler and you’ll see my page come up and there you go.

Matt: Awesome, awesome. The question I’ve always liked to ask our guest the last question is, Mark what’s in your future that you’re really excited about?

Mark: Wow. What am I really excited about? Well I’m excited that I’m trying to finish up the audio for my book with the 2012 update for “Lawyers Are Liars” and that should be out like January. I wanted to get my books on every possible audio site. The audio books I think is more and more where there are things are going.

My books are both on Nook and Kindle and iPad already. I want to get my books out there more readily available. So that’s what I’m working on for January. I’m really excited about that.

Matt: Awesome, awesome. Well Mark, you did not disappoint, Sir. Thank you for coming on this show. I know you are a really busy guy these days. You’re balancing so many different things. I’m sure that this episode is going to inspire some new questions. Would you be open to coming back some time in the future?

Mark: Yes please. I would love to. Thank you. Gosh, anybody that’s interested getting in an appointment in me or learning more about us, you can easily just go to my website MarkJKohler, K-O-H-L-E-R,

Just click on, “Contact Me” and you can sign up for a little interview with me for 15 minutes, one-on-one and I’ll get you set up with my team. I still take new appointments all the time.  I’m only out a week or two. So, give me a call.

Matt: Perfect. This will be a great time to do it too, at the end of the year, wouldn’t it?

Mark: Yeah. Well Matt thanks so much.

Matt: You’re welcome. Thank you. You’ve really delivered the goods and I appreciate it. Thank you.

Mark: You bet. Alright. Thank you.

Matt: We’ll talk soon.

Matt: Okay, that’s it for today. If you want to learn more from Mark and his company or perhaps you want to even hire Mark, you can find him and all the information you need at That’s Mark, M-A-R-K, middle initial is J, or you can subscribe to his podcast of which I wasn’t even aware that he had one.

But he does and I just checked it out and it’s up to date and everything. Imagine that, just search the Mark Kohler show at iTunes and it’ll pop right up. So until next time, as a very wise person once said, “The income tax has made liars out of more Americans that golf.” The sad thing is nobody would have to lie if they just buy real estate. I mean most Americans can virtually eliminate their tax liability with the purchase and holding of just a couple investment properties.

You can virtually eliminate that tax liability doing that honestly, ethically, morally, legally and even with the government’s consent, with the government’s blessing even. That’s how the tax code is written. So consider Mark’s advice today. Buy one investment property per year. To your success, I’m Matt Theriault, living the dream.

(Voice Over): Thank you for spending this time with Matt Theriault and the Epic Real Estate Investing Podcast. When you have a moment, stop by iTunes to leave your comments and let us know what you think of the show and if you haven’t done so already, get started investing today by visiting To access Matt’s free course, how to do deals no money required. Until next time, to your success.

Matt Theriault

Real estate investor and educator.